These are transcripts from a picket in Edmonton, Canada, Sept 9, 2000. This was transcribed from video footage, which I hope to have webbed in the near future. Picketers inlcuded Gerry Armstrong, Reg Taylor, Darlene Taylor, John Brownlee, and Shane Wilson (yours truly).
This segment is a conversation between Reg, Gerry, and Andre Jurt, the
husband of the local DSA, Deborah Jurt.
Reg: This man (Gerry) actually saw all this stuff himself, he handled the original documents - Ron's old diaries, and legal papers from his second divorce, and all that stuff. He found all of Hubbard's personal Papers, and he's out here standing there holding the sign.
Andre: Well, let me put it this way...
Reg: If he told you that he actually saw it with his own eyes, why don't you believe it?
Andre: In all I know about 30 people who worked with Hubbard, and he's one of them out of 30 - there's 29 others Reg: Right, but this guy actually handled Hubbard's personal papers. He was Hubbard's personal archivist. Hubbard assigned him as his personal archivist. And he was on that post - how long were you on that post, 2 years?
Gerry: 2 years Reg: He was on that post for a full 2 years, talking to all of Hubbard's relatives, and everybody who knew Hubbard, and he's standing out here saying Scientology is bogus.
Reg: Is OT III the last one you did?
Gerry: Yes Reg: He's OT III, and we're standing out here and if we're wrong, if we're full of crap, we're putting our eternity on the line here, ok? We know the significance of this. So this is not done lightly. I know that if I'm wrong, my eternity is ruined, and Gerry knows it too. We're trying to say to people, look at this, and say you know what, there are untruths, flat out untruths in Scientology that need to be confronted. How can you base a movement on a lie?
Andre: I have no idea what you're talking about. You're talking in generalities.
Reg: Alright, I can be more specific. Hubbard's biography, ok, ah, I mean maybe it's irrelevant that Hubbard never finished college. Maybe it's irrelevant that Ron is not a war hero, that he's not a nuclear physicist.
Maybe those things are irrelevant.
Gerry: That he wasn't crippled and blinded and he didn't cure himself with Dianetics. And you're right, they are, however what is relevant is that he lied about them.
Andre: Well, for one thing, I can't talk to you because you're declared, ok? You're not (meaning Reg).
Gerry: To me, that, what you just articulated, is one of the basic reasons that people should protest, and you yourself should protest. The Suppressive Person doctrine is really the basis of Scientology. It affects your life more than all of your auditing, more than all of your training.
Just the acceptance of the Suppressive Person doctrine, the dividing of society on religions grounds, not scientific, pseudo-scientific grounds, whereby it then becomes totally ok for a designated Suppressive Person to be lied to, cheated, stolen from, destroyed.
Andre: Ok, I'm talking to you (Reg), what was your last point?
Reg: Well, my point is, these things are coming out because Scientology no longer has control over information, they can't stop people from posting things on the net.
Andre: What are you even talking about?
Gerry: Am I right? He's not talking to me because I'm declared, but his wife can talk to me because she's the person who's designated to handle me?
Is that how it works?
Andre: right Gerry: See, that's the criminal element in Scientology. The people who may still have some decency left in them, they're not allowed to talk to a basic wog. That's why people should protest. And you should protest. You should stand up and put an end to the Suppressive Person doctrine. Put an end to fair game. Stand up.
Andre: Let's make one point, one point. I choose not to talk to you. Not
because I'm told, I choose not to talk to you. If I choose not to talk to
you, I won't talk to you. You understand that?
Gerry: I understand that Andre: Ok, that's my choice, I don't want to talk to you Gerry: I understand. And you choose because you say I'm a declared Suppressive Person.
Andre: That's correct.
Gerry: And I say that that doctrine is the reason why Scientology, and people like yourself should be opposed, you should be exposed, it is a doctrine...
Andre: I don't talk to an enemy the same way I don't take my son to a child molester for babysitting, ok? I choose not to do that, I choose not to talk to you.
Gerry: And I'm an enemy because your organization designated me an enemy.
Andre: No, it's because of your destructive actions.
Gerry: And what are those destructive actions, do you know any of them?
Speaking the truth? Is that a destructive action? Having an opinion?
Articulating my opinion? Adhering to the Creed of Scientology?
Andre: As a matter of fact, yes, it is, according to the policy Gerry: And that's what I'm saying. That's what you need to oppose. That is itself a suppressive policy. It doesn't give you the opportunity, in your life, to really think for yourself. You can't - you follow policy, which is a suppressive policy.
Andre: I happen to agree with the policy.
Gerry: That's fine. You agree with a suppressive policy, and it was designed to suppress you, to keep you from communicating.
To be continued ...